Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense
The media is still buzzing with President Obama’s recent announcement that he personally favors same-sex marriage. In 1996, he favored it. In 2004, though, he rejected it (affirming civil unions) on grounds of his Christian convictions that marriage is a “sanctified” union of a man and woman. Now he has reversed that position, again offering his Christian convictions (loving neighbors and being in a church community that accepts same-sex couples) as a rationale.
Speculations about political motivations aside, the President is hardly alone in his waffling over this controversial issue of significance for American society. Nor is he alone among those who say that they affirm same-sex marriage—or their own homosexual lifestyle—as something that is affirmed by God and their Christian commitment.
Makes a Lot of Sense?
Both sides trade Bible verses, while often sharing an unbiblical—secularized—theological framework at a deeper level. If God exists for our happiness and self-fulfillment, validating our sovereign right to choose our identity, then opposition to same-sex marriage (or abortion) is just irrational prejudice.
Given the broader worldview that many Americans (including Christians) embrace—or at least assume, same-sex marriage is a right to which anyone is legally entitled. After all, traditional marriages in our society are largely treated as contractual rather than covenantal, means of mutual self-fulfillment more than serving a larger purpose ordained by God. The state of the traditional family is so precarious that one wonders how same-sex marriage can appreciably deprave it.
Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. To the extent that this sort of “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” prevails in our churches, can we expect the world to think any differently? If we treat God as a product we sell to consumers for their self-improvement programs and make personal choice the trigger of salvation itself, then it may come as a big surprise (even contradiction) to the world when we tell them that truth (the way things are) trumps feelings and personal choice (what we want to make things to be).
Plausibility Structures
The secularist mantra, “You can’t legislate morality,” is a shibboleth. Defenders of same-sex marriage moralize as much as anyone. They appeal to dogmas like freedom of choice, individualism, love, respect, acceptance (not, tolerance, mind you, but acceptance), and excoriate religiously traditional opponents as hypocritical in failing to follow the loving example of Jesus. The agenda is plainly as ethical as any other. Whatever is decided at state and federal levels, a certain version of morality will most certainly be legislated.
What this civic debate—like others, such as abortion and end-of-life ethics—reveals is the significance of worldviews. Shaped within particular communities, our worldviews constitute what Peter Berger and Thomas Luckmann coined as “plausibility structures.” Some things make sense, and others don’t, because of the tradition that has shaped us. We don’t just have a belief here and a belief there; our convictions are part of a web. Furthermore, many of these beliefs are assumptions that we haven’t tested, in part because we’re not even focally aware that we have them. We use them every day, though, and in spite of some inconsistencies they all hold together pretty firmly—unless a crisis (intellectual, moral, experiential) makes us lose confidence in the whole web.
Every worldview arises from a narrative—a story about who we are, how we got here, the meaning of history and our own lives, expectations for the future. From this narrative arise certain convictions (doctrines and ethical beliefs) that make that story significant for us. No longer merely assenting to external facts, we begin to indwell that story; it becomes ours as we respond to it and then live out its implications.
I’ve argued that in Christianity this can be described familiar terms of the drama, doctrine, doxology, and discipleship. But you see it in every worldview. Take Friedrich Nietzsche, for example. The late 19th-century philosopher believed that we came from nowhere meaningful and are going nowhere meaningful, but in the middle of it all we can create meaning for ourselves. Freed from an external creator, law-giver, redeemer, and consummator, we are finally on our own. The parents are on holiday (if there is a parent), and it’s party-time. In Romans, Paul identifies our fallen condition as a pathological inability to be thankful. After all, if reality is an accidental given of a random and impersonal universe rather than a gift of a purposeful God, then the only meaning we have is that which we design and execute for ourselves.
It’s something like Nietzsche’s narrative—the “Nowhere Man” poised to make something of his own individualism and will to power—that creates the plausibility structure of contemporary living in the West. Its central dogma is the will to power and its doxology is actually self-congratulatory, like Walt Whitman’s “Song of Myself.” It yields masters and consumers rather than pilgrims and disciples.
The fact that “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” is the working theology of Americans—whether evangelicals, Catholics, mainline Protestants, or agnostics—demonstrates the pervasiveness of secularization even in our churches. The old actors may still be invoked: God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit. Bits of the old narrative may still be mentioned: creation, providence, redemption, salvation, heaven. However, the shift is evident enough. These old words are mapped onto an essentially human-centered rather than God-centered map. The map is the autonomous self’s striving to create a sense of meaning, purpose, and significance. Each individual writes his or her own script or life movie. “God” may still have a meaningful role as a supporting actor in our self-realization and peace of mind, but we’re the playwright, director, and star.
So when we come to debates about same-sex marriage in civic debates, even professions of deeply held Christian commitments can be invoked without the biblical narrative, doctrines and commands, doxology, and discipleship actually providing the authoritative source and structural integrity to our arguments.
Conservatives often appeal to self-fulfillment: gays are unhappy. They don’t realize their own potential to mate with the right gender and produce pleasant families like the rest of us. To be sure, there are other arguments, like referring to the decline of civilizations that accommodated homosexuality. However, this is just to extend the pragmatic-and-therapeutic-usefulness presupposition of individual autonomy to a social scale.
On this common ground, same-sex marriage is a no-brainer. Some people are happier and more fulfilled in committed same-sex relationships. There’s no use trying to refute other people’s emotional expressions of their own subjective states of consciousness. Do same-sex couples wrestle with tension, anxiety over a partner losing interest and being attracted to someone else, infidelity, and so forth? Looking at the state of traditional marriage, how exactly are these couples uniquely dysfunctional? A 2006 Amicus Brief presented to the California Supreme Court by the nation’s leading psychological and psychiatric bodies argued, “Gay men and lesbians form stable, committed relationships that are equivalent to heterosexual relationships in essential respects. The institution of marriage offers social, psychological, and health benefits that are denied to same-sex couples…There is no scientific basis for distinguishing between same-sex couples and heterosexual couples with respect to the legal rights, obligations, benefits, and burdens conferred by civil marriage.” Well, there you have it. The new high priests of the national soul have spoken.
How would someone who believes that sin is unhappiness and salvation is having “your best life now” make a good argument against same-sex marriage? There is simply no way of defending traditional marriage within the narrative logic that apparently most Christians—much less non-Christians—presuppose regardless of their position on this issue.



May 11th, 2012 at 8:56 am
Very, very insightful, well-written and thought-provoking. Are you going to follow this up with the response of true Christianity? I await it eagerly.
May 11th, 2012 at 9:15 am
I agree with leopard139. Very insightful! I came out of a movement that had “me” at the center. I have never been more at peace in the midst of strife since knowing our all sovereign God after repenting and being born again. It’s not about us, its all about Him, and that changes everything.
May 11th, 2012 at 9:19 am
I second that – living here in MA it’s a constant struggle to resist the tide: being wise as serpents yet innocent as doves, as we are commanded.
May 11th, 2012 at 9:25 am
By far the best article I’ve read on this. Self or man centered religion IS the world’s religion. Some people mistakenly think it can also be called Christianity. Well said! Thank you for writing and explaining what’s actually takin place and cutting through the exterior arguments.
May 11th, 2012 at 10:12 am
[...] This post, from Mike Horton, illustrates why–absent a revival in our churches–the gay marriage debate will be lost on religious grounds before it is lost on political grounds. In fact, the startling and significant reversal of public opinion on same-sex marriage may be due, in part, to the trends that Horton identifies. [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 10:14 am
Fabulous article. I also await your truly Christian response. I have trouble putting it into words myself!
May 11th, 2012 at 10:35 am
Does Michael Horton ever miss? Thank you for nailing the true underlying issue. This movement is ultimately consistent with our first document as we declared our independence and our rights to pursue L, L and the pursuit of holiness? nah..happiness. Thank you!
May 11th, 2012 at 10:41 am
YES! What precisely is the Christian position on this issue? I have read the scriptures used to say homosexuality is abhorrent to our God; but I am not convinced that’s what is said. Or, is it that God made woman for man / procreation / authored & designed marriage?
I would honestly like a Bible teaching on the subject that I can work through, believe as truth, and incorporate into my narrative. Thank you, Connie
May 11th, 2012 at 10:41 am
I think that some of those who commented are misreading this article. I believe the author, like me, is not for gay marriage. Am I wrong?
May 11th, 2012 at 10:43 am
I echo the above sentiments re. the thoughtfulness of this article. (Do I like it just because I agree with it?? Hmm, another topic for another day…) Where I get tripped up with this issue is how I should address it with regard to how our government is structured. While I oppose same-sex marriage on religious grounds, can I as a US Christian oppose it on legal grounds within the context of our democracy? If I uphold the separation of church and state (which I do) and believe in equal rights (which I do), I don’t see how I can support a legislative ban on same-sex marriage. At the same time, I’m very concerned that granting same-sex marriage rights will lead to legal issues for churches who do not agree with same-sex marriage. I hope to read some comments to help me with this.
May 11th, 2012 at 10:46 am
Next layer, then…
Seeing the question in a generational social fabric. Civilization is passed on within the home, and the hallmark of the civilization being passed on in these homes is self-centeredness.
This is true of the homes that dissolve in divorce or acrimony as well. And the unwed homes.
I think that this is merely an aftershock of the real shift embodied in society’s generational lurch toward a frenetic, desperate sexual… apathy. The real death of marriage happened decades ago.
It’s the children of these fragmented parents that are left rootless, and who will pass on nothing of use.
May 11th, 2012 at 10:59 am
Not really a whole lot to add. Like everyone else, I appreciate the coverage of the topic (dovetailed right in with the WHI CD on Worship Experience I started during this morning’s drive). I think Michael Horton answers much of the rhetoric that is commonly used. However, I struggle with my own response to this in a civil realm.
Generally, in personal life, I get that we should strive to follow God’s standards for morality, but I struggle with the concept of enforcing that civilly. Growing up in an ultra-fundamentalistic church culture, I would loathe some of the “Bible teaches” rules that we were given to be enshrined in law.
I also know of sincere, heterosexual theologians who are trying to honor God who would argue that the Bible doesn’t condemn homosexuality, or at least not any more than eating bacon. While I don’t necessarily agree with their interpretation, is this really an issue of “liberty” that we agree to disagree on?
Finally, being new to the Reformed worldview, I also struggle with the idea of legislating Christian morals on the non-elect. Is America a Christian nation? Should our laws be a full-on legislation of morality (and in that case, who decides), or should we simply enshrine laws that (in a very libertarian view) prevent one person or entity from abusing or taking advantage of another?
Long comment to simply say I agree with everyone else. Tearing away the surface rhetoric is important and good. Exposing the MTD in the general arguments is good. But I am still at a loss to answer these other questions.
May 11th, 2012 at 11:20 am
As a twenty-three year-old Christian who left Mormonism three years ago, I’m glad that I’m not the only one struggling with this. My faith is very strongly against same-sex marriage and it has taken me a while to get to the point where I can honestly say, “I don’t know.” I’ve had veiled attacks come from people I family about my lack of knowledge on the matter, but the truth is we live in a nation where the hierarchical structure is much different than the way the Kingdom of God is set up and I think we forget that. I’ve always been raised to believe America is a Christian nation and sin is ruining everything God set up, but I still have yet to find any factual and irrefutable evidence of this nation of ours being a Christian nation. If anything, we have abused our privilege of religious freedom by way of attacking and hating others who feel differently. But that’s besides the point. My question mostly lies in: how do we address the political realm? While I do not agree that same-sex marriage is something God rejoices over, do we outlaw it, despite this country clearly being a mixture of various theological stances? Or do we leave it up to the states to decide? I definitely don’t agree that the federal government should have the final word. And if we outlaw this, why don’t we go back to outlawing everything that furthers sin? Why is it merely same-sex marriage and not gluttony and drunkenness and all forms of adultery? These are things I wrestle with and have never found any true advice from the evangelical realms. Nearly everyone I talk to comes to me with a mindset formed from years and years of tradition rather than true humility to the Word of God. If anyone would feel comfortable discussing this with me, my email is dlmarshall3@gmail.com I’m willing to be wrong if that means God can show me He is right. That’s the way I’ve been living my life and I can’t say I regret it. It’s His will that’s to be done and He’s more than willing to keep us going in that direction if we are.
May 11th, 2012 at 11:20 am
I meant to say my previous faith, as in Mormonism. My apologies.
May 11th, 2012 at 11:25 am
[...] Horton’s Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense Albert Mohler’s Evolution’s End? President Obama Calls for Same-Sex Marriage Kevin [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 11:40 am
[...] “Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense” by Michael Horton Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. To the extent that this sort of “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” prevails in our churches, can we expect the world to think any differently? If we treat God as a product we sell to consumers for their self-improvement programs and make personal choice the trigger of salvation itself, then it may come as a big surprise (even contradiction) to the world when we tell them that truth (the way things are) trumps feelings and personal choice (what we want to make things to be). Share this:ShareFacebookTwitterEmailPrintLike this:LikeBe the first to like this post. [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 11:45 am
Well written and a truly clear perspective. The issue, ultimately, lies in the hands of those arguing and in the case of the “Christian Right” in America – the egocentric deism of much of so called American Christianity is actually the same thing that so called Non Christians believe. It’s about our happiness. So if you root that in the middle and then build your worldview – it matters little what you claim along the way – you end up back at the same illogical point to go against same sex marriage. I believe in personal happiness provided by God – but only if they match my rules per what I perceive thru God. Foolishness and why this is not going to end well but it will end with God still firmly in control. Soli Deo gloria.
May 11th, 2012 at 12:00 pm
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense May.11, 2012 by Michael Horton in General [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 12:20 pm
This is fantastic. I, too, agree with leopard139– please do a follow up!
May 11th, 2012 at 12:25 pm
[...] “Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense” (White Horse Inn) Share this:ShareEmailPrintLike this:LikeBe the first to like this post. This [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 12:35 pm
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes A Lot of Sense [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 12:54 pm
Dr. Horton, could you expand on the following: “So when we come to debates about same-sex marriage in civic debates, even professions of deeply held Christian commitments can be invoked without the biblical narrative, doctrines and commands, doxology, and discipleship actually providing the authoritative source and structural integrity to our arguments.” Are you critiquing the way it is often done, or promoting a way to do it? I have read you as meaning the former, but I want to be sure. Thanks!
May 11th, 2012 at 1:07 pm
I’m with Abraham – I just want to live on the other end of the valley and be left out of this!
May 11th, 2012 at 1:33 pm
[...] Horton weighs in on Same Sex Marriage. Share this:EmailPrintFacebookTwitterMoreDiggRedditStumbleUponLike this:LikeBe the first to like [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 1:43 pm
The Catechism of the Catholic Church says that homosexual acts are “contrary to the natural law” and can never be approved and that marriage is the sacramental union of a man and a woman.
“Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that ‘homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered,’” says the Catechism. “They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
“The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible,” says the Catechism. “This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
“Homosexual persons are called to chastity,” says the Catechism. “Sexuality is ordered to the conjugal love of man and woman.”
May 11th, 2012 at 2:39 pm
[...] Same-sex marriage makes a lot of sense. Share this: Pin ItMorePrintEmailLike this:LikeBe the first to like this post. This entry was posted in Christianity, Politics, Theology and tagged Christianity, Marriage, Michael Horton, sin. Bookmark the permalink. [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 3:08 pm
[...] that in mind, I’m following up my previous post (“Same-Sex Marriage Makes Sense”) with a few thoughts about how we as Christians should ground our corporate beliefs about marriage [...]
May 11th, 2012 at 3:47 pm
Shawn: “I think that some of those who commented are misreading this article. I believe the author, like me, is not for gay marriage. Am I wrong?”
It’s a good question.
Does Dr. Horton approve of North Carolina Pastor JD Greear’s message to his church as pastor about Amendment One and the voting behavior of his congregational members:
The Summit Church and The Marriage Amendment
Excerpts:
“At the same time, there is a time, when out of love for our neighbor, civic action is appropriate and ought to be commended by the church. The church should have been vocal during the civil rights movement in the 1960’s and women’s suffrage movement of the early 20th century.
I believe this is another one of those times.
Marriage is a wonderfully sacred institution, given by God as a blessing to–and the building block of–all societies. Government did not define or establish marriage; God did. Governments merely recognize that which has been established by the Creator.
Our country’s Declaration of Independence acknowledges that the foundation of human flourishing is God and His designs. “We are endowed by our Creator,” Thomas Jefferson wrote, “with certain inalienable rights.” Our most fundamental rights flow from the design of the Creator.
One of the Creator’s most important designs was marriage, which He established as between a man and a woman. The Creator’s pattern has been perceived throughout history by nearly every religion in the world and Christian tradition has stood nearly unbroken on this, until about 40 years ago.
I think it is crucial for us to speak up–again, as an act of love for our neighbors–for the preservation of this institution in our society.
…
So, I encourage you go out and vote in support of this amendment this Tuesday. I want you to do so as an act of service and love for our community.”
(Read it all.)
May 11th, 2012 at 4:07 pm
Brilliantly done and – from a theological point of view – irrefutable.
May 11th, 2012 at 4:25 pm
Good article on why some Christians can end up accepting gay marriage, but I think we are distracted from the real issues that drove many to vote against Amendment 1. It is well summarized here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaJ2iF9oLi0&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I think the essential element of love as holding together the fabric of creation is minimized here– & no I don’t agree with homosexuality or gay marriage. But we are biting on distractions from our core mission–great commandment/great commission. I don’t see evidence that we know how to have dissenting conversations among the body of Christ while loving each other. We are so concerned with being right in the disagreement, we miss being right about leaving no debt outstanding accept that of loving each other. They will know we follow Him the way we love one another.
May 11th, 2012 at 4:51 pm
dr. horton or anyone: how do you share the gospel with homeosexuals then…there was a book out called “no perfect people allowed” about an austin texas church, whose preacher, a former willowcreek pastor learned that getting folks with addictions into a loving environment and then revealing to them the holiness of God while allowing the Holy Spirit to work was a more effective way to seeing changed lives…..if they know Jesus accepts them and does not condemn them; can this be the door through they walk to get healing and repent? or do you say ‘check your sin at the door”
May 11th, 2012 at 7:28 pm
Dave, a similar question has been bugging me for a while. If someone does not affirm the gospel after you have shared it with them, what the heck do you do? Do you shake the dust off your sandals and go to the next person? Is it that some sinners are worth spending your time with and others not?
May 11th, 2012 at 8:31 pm
In the eyes of God all sin is equally abhorrent. But Paul does point out that sexual sins are more damaging and harder to control/get rid of because it is a sin against our own flesh. Homosexuality is no more abhorrent to God than heterosexual sex outside of marriage is; both are out of God’s will for human life; both are sins.
That being said it didn’t work for the government to outlaw excessive drinking. It won’t do to outlaw lying and adultery hasn’t been a crime for years now. Why is anyone surprised then that same-sex marriage is being approved of in our society? The world is dying has been since Eve bit the fruit from the tree. One thing will rid the world of sin: the coming of our King. Until then picketing in front of our government buildings will be useless. So will yelling and screaming about our faith being trampled. Share the gospel to all sinners no matter what sin they are deepest in. If they don’t accept it pray for them and move on. Why are we wasting our time crying out about one sin just because it is dominating the stage at the moment? Cry out in LOVE against them all by living in a way that pleases the Lord. How about making OUR marriages strong then we will have a leg to stand on.
May 11th, 2012 at 8:38 pm
And Other AJ: I say yes to your question. All people deserve to HEAR the gospel but some like Pharaoh in Exodus close off their hearts and eventually we have to move on. Plant the seeds and try to water them. But if the seeds are rejected out of hand don’t keep trying to shove them into thorny or shallow ground. Let the Spirit change the soil then our seeds may sink in. Yes some people are worth spending more time with in that sense because their ground is ready. Fallow ground won’t be worth anything until it is broken up. WE can’t do the breaking; only Jesus can.
For example: a sister in Christ and her husband tried to witness to their friend for a long time. He rejected the gospel time after time. Finally they told him they were not going to talk about Jesus with him again and they didn’t. A year later he accepted the Lord and gave his life to Him. He passed away but is now with Jesus. Hallelujah!
May 11th, 2012 at 9:48 pm
Reading some of the post, I think some people need to first get a better idea about how Christians should relate to the state and society. Everything we do is not done as Christians, and I think that is particularly the case with voting. I have views as to what the state should do about marriage, but this is not from my Christian conviction about the morality of homosexuality, but from secular reasons. I think too many people mix their earthly and heavenly citizenships; in the end they end up with flawed theologies and the reinterpretation of Scripture (if not it’s rejection), they end up with bits if not full blown theocratic ambitions, or some mixture of the two. Maybe this is over simplistic, but it does describe many Christians in our country.
There needs to be a healthy separation of our duties and beliefs as Christians and our duties as citizens without violating our Christian beliefs. David VanDrunen’s work and commentary would be very helpful.
As a person who opposes the recognition of homosexual marriage, I don’t see a need to refer to Scripture or argue from it. Christians need to learn to think; they shouldn’t have to always look towards their pastors or theologians to make rational decisions based on secular reasons.
May 11th, 2012 at 10:16 pm
Those who maintain the “separation of church and state” stance where the Church is not permitted to discuss political opinion, I hope you really do consider what the Constitution says instead of what you want to read into it based on even historical additions: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” The founding fathers were concerned about a denominationally-ran state of affairs for the government similar to what was encountered before they came here. It states nothing to the effect of any great wall/barrier between the two which allows the government to separate the religious establishment’s speech or attitudes from political engenderment. Moving on…
I see Christians today affected much the same way they were affected by eugenics and mass discriminatory murders close to the time of World War II (and before). Christians then felt the “problems” of the war were far from home, and the same here with the war on the sanctity and holiness of marriage – as long as YOUR home is safe, who cares if another wants to desecrate the constitution and covenant of marriage? It happens with people’s opinions of abortion in the same attitude (see 180movie.com – very good), if they envision themselves as saying “it’s ok to bury a jew alive or kill a jew” they will find themselves repulsed and their conscience argues against it, but when it comes to the subject of abortion a lot will say “it’s ok – a woman should have a right to choose.” Murder is murder, unless you can redetermine the definition of “life” or “possession of life”…right? We are seeing more and more Christians play the Bill Clinton game of redefining terms and trying to dance around technicalities, hoping we can avoid searing our conscience and instead adhering to our own goodness and opinions, stating all is gray, and those who oppose the happy middleground are simply advocating an unjust black & white.
The Declaration of Independence starts its 2nd paragraph as follows: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.” Most people now concentrate on the very last part only “pursuit of happiness” to justify their means to this end. I believe that the right of a baby (“Life”) and the bi-products of marriage (child-birthing “Life” again) & a picture of God’s perfect love for His body through Christ (“Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness”) are self-evident. (Sorry for side-tracking about abortion by the way, but felt it was another area of sin to cover in the same relation.)
Last I would give the appeal from the book and story of Jonah – how many of us, knowing as Jonah did that God desires people to repent and turn from their wicked ways, are yet relenting and not wanting these modern-day ninevites to be removed from their practices? Should we flee God’s presence and remain in the safety of our own homes, ignoring God’s desire to turn a people or learn as Jonah did to speak the truth through praise, thanksgiving, and sacrifice?
May 12th, 2012 at 5:12 am
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense - Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. To the extent that this sort of “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” prevails in our churches, can we expect the world to think any differently? If we treat God as a product we sell to consumers for their self-improvement programs and make personal choice the trigger of salvation itself, then it may come as a big surprise (even contradiction) to the world when we tell them that truth (the way things are) trumps feelings and personal choice (what we want to make things to be). – Michael Horton [...]
May 12th, 2012 at 7:53 am
Just a thought – When Paul denounces homosexuality, is he not addressing the church? And yes, it is wrong outside of the church as well (since God is the standard). But as far as judging outsiders – 1 Cor 5:12 – who am I to judge them?
I believe I need to be clear to the homosexuals that are in my life, if and when I am asked (or in some way have an opening), that I know and believe the homosexual life-style is wrong, but, can’t I live in the same community, work with them, laugh with them and grieve with them – as Jesus did with the prostitutes? Even using this as a way to call them to repentance and faith in Christ?
I guess my question is the same as others – How do I show love in the face of this? It is not to accept it as an “alternative”, but there has to be a way to show grace as God has shown me grace.
May 12th, 2012 at 1:09 pm
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. [...]
May 12th, 2012 at 2:11 pm
I wanted to say that I’ve gotten numerous responses from people on this blog and I wanted to say thank you for being so incredible and loving and compassionate. I’m still open to discussing with anyone that is curious about this matter, as I’m seeing I’m not the only one who sees how this situation isn’t as black and white as some may make it out to be. Our comprehension is so limited to the Lord’s and I feel that if we keep making this a “I am right, you are wrong” argument consistently, we will never progress as a body of Christ. It is not our job to dictate who is a part of the body of Christ or not; it is our part to love and restore those out of sin in gentleness and patience.
May 12th, 2012 at 2:27 pm
Dave–yes! Your last post is the spirit I posted in earlier! There is a HUGE opportunity to show love to people who don’t expect it from us at all–I say let’s be light about how God values each of us instead of picking each other apart! Bridges to build?
May 12th, 2012 at 5:19 pm
“The state of the traditional family is so precarious that one wonders how same-sex marriage can appreciably deprave it.”
And that shaky state, even in churches, expanded its compass in the name of self-centered ‘love’ and ‘forgiveness’ to include same-sex marriages.
We really need to clarify the basics like Christian love which must have a Christ-centered focus rather than a self-centered one. Otherwise, it is just another heresy.
http://www.amazon.com/Love-Prayer-Forgiveness-Michael-Snow/dp/159467664X/ref=la_B001KMODGY_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1336868281&sr=1-3
May 12th, 2012 at 5:30 pm
Michael–the books you’ve authored look interesting. Thanks for the link. I agree–love that is Christ-centered gets to the real thing that has real power. We can strengthen the shaky state learning to do life in grace and truth. You have a good desire to honor God in and through the conversation, and it seems, to do it beyond the warm-fuzzy, luke-warm, love to one that lasts. (Won’t keep posting to go to excess, but am engaged in the conversation–and it seemed you may have been responding to my last post).
May 12th, 2012 at 5:43 pm
i am finishing an insightful book by theologian, JI Packer, `972 called “knowing God” got this great insight when i needed it yesterday…one of my facebook brothers wrote a mocking version of the “our father” so other christians could indulge themselves in more pride and arrogance about how those pitiful heathens who don’t know what marriage is, i thought it was very unbecoming but had no intention to call him out…….this stemmed from the recent marriage vote in NC that spurned a facebook “rock throwing” contest
here’s packer in chapter 21….”a certain type of minstry of the gospel is cruel”..”but if it is doctrinally sound then what can go wrong with it?”…”the answer is that a ministry which is wholly concerned with gospel truths can still go wrong by giving those truths an inaccurate application.” J I Packer “knowing God” ch 21 pg 222
May 12th, 2012 at 5:55 pm
to other AJ, if they do not affirm i think you have to continue a minstry of love….remember the parable of the sower and the seed? if the devil can snatch it away, we need to keep scattering it more….and pray…we cannot back off the spiritual warfare component of this….i have come to the conclusion that how could i condemn two gay friends i love dearly, one a college roommate, the other a former work colleague when i am aware myself, “of what a wrteched man I am” so this takes me to romans 8….thank god for the word that does not condemn me anymore…..misapplied theogoly is the denial, in my view, that the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit, is a process and this lightning bolt “you’re fixed” spiritual healing, which is asserted by some leading american evangelists , who are great teachers, but insist that you are saved, is missapplied “cruel” theology…. you still struggle and we need to renew ourselves each day, and…what if you can’t obey in the flesh? we know we can’t do this, but only conquer in the spirit… we need a pastor to preach “grace” and the “ministry of the helper” who Warren Wiersebe calls the “strengthener” not the conforter as if we’re all babies who need a blanket to help us in our pity party….
May 12th, 2012 at 6:36 pm
@ Prufrock:
As a woman with children who’s been through a divorce, I take extreme exception to your statements:
“This is true of the homes that dissolve in divorce or acrimony as well. And the unwed homes.
I think that this is merely an aftershock of the real shift embodied in society’s generational lurch toward a frenetic, desperate sexual… apathy. The real death of marriage happened decades ago.
It’s the children of these fragmented parents that are left rootless, and who will pass on nothing of use.”
How dare you make such a statement regarding the children of divorce? I can assure you that my children are not being raised in a culture of self-centeredness, as you state. I love Jesus; my atheist ex-husband did not. Do not pass judgment on me or on the potential of my children to live lives that honor God and bring glory to his name! Even Christ does not condemn. Scripture tells us that the ONLY one who condemns is Satan himself.
It is people like you who cause the world to see Christians as judgmental and hypocritical. Listen to Casting Crowns’ “Jesus, Friend of Sinners” sometime. No one has the authority or the invitation to pigeon-hole people into some pre-made concept. God is the author and sustainer of life, he is at work in me and in my children, and he is the final word on the matter.
May 12th, 2012 at 7:48 pm
@Connie
Paul’s argument in Romans 1 and also in 1 Cor. 6:9-11 shows that homosexual relationships are not desired in the sight of God (among other sins). In the beginning, God made them man and woman, and it was for a purpose.
That does not mean that homosexuals may ever lose the urges they may have, but like every other person, it is about coming God through the washing of our sins and walking in His light. My desire is that we show them love, just as we all need it, by sharing the one who Is Love.
Hope it helps. May God bless you.
May 12th, 2012 at 8:01 pm
I like Horton, but I sort of wish there was more to this particular posting. How does God fit in this drama and what does he think? What should I be telling my neighbour other than that he and I are self-centred?
May 12th, 2012 at 10:53 pm
I’m reading David Bentley Hart’s “Atheist Delusions”, and came across this today, which seems relevant: “If freedom of the will is our supreme value, after all, then it is for all intents and purposes our god.”
May 13th, 2012 at 2:32 am
Gay marriage may be sin, but should it be illegal under state law? Should state law serve to outlaw sin? For consistency’s sake, which sins should be illegal and which should not? Or would you rather state law was more along pragmatic lines? In which case, why not allow gay marriage?
May 13th, 2012 at 4:24 am
Thanks for this deepening of responsible discussion on same-sex marriage. One of my friends on Facebook posted a link to Micheael Horton’s right-on blog. Here’s a heads-up: several of those who commented raised the important question of the difference between a having a Christian stance on same-sex marriage and “imposing” that stance on the rest of society when we live in a democracy with freedom of religion and not in a Christian nation. For insight into this question (for this issue and many others), I’d like to recommend the Center for Public Justice at cpjustice.org. They have a unique and very helpful position on how Christians should act in the public arena, how to be a consistently Christian citizen and/or public office-holder within a pluralist democracy.
Also are you aware of the Manhattan Declaration? Things written by Robert (and Timothy?) George are very good. One of them is a professor at Harvard or Harvard Law School, and a top-notch Christian thinker.
As for likening the opposition to government recognition of same-sex marriage to the legislation of morality (blue laws, laws against adultery), this is comparing apples and oranges. This issue is not about laws against gay sex, nor gays living together, just as it’s not about laws against adultery or fornication or co-habitation by heterosexual couples. All adults in the U.S., whether gay or straight, already have the freedom to indulge in this behavior.
This issue is about what constitutes marriage and whether there should be a “right” to marriage.
May 13th, 2012 at 4:32 am
“Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction.”
This sentence makes sense unless you realize that marriage, whether of straight couples or gay couples, is by definition not about individual self-centerdness. Then you realize this sentence is a massive insult to gay people and even many straight people. Whether you like it or not, gay people are part of society, and gay couples do in fact contribute to society. Also, whether you like it or not at the end of the day every argument against government recognition of same sex civil marriage boils down to it being against your religious beliefs, and wanting the government to enforce those beliefs on those who do not share them. Which is why you will win many battles and lose the war. Of course, the real beauty of it is that when you end up losing the war you won’t actually lose anything, as you will continue to retain the right to have yourself as traditional a marriage as you please. Believe it or not, you can choose to have a traditional marriage in Massachusets right now. You’re not “defending” anything except the special privilege of having the government force other people to live by your religious beliefs. Like it or not, that is not actually a right.
May 13th, 2012 at 6:42 am
We live in a Time when personhood is denied to many sons and daughters who reside in their Mother’s womb, and yet, sexual inclinations have been given personhood, in order that it may appear that those of us who, out of Love and respect for all persons, refuse to condone same-sex sexual acts, or any sexual act that demeans the inherent Dignity of the person, are discriminating against a person, rather than sexual acts. The Gospel of Life is Life-affirming and Life-sustaining. Any act, including sexual act, that does not respect the inherent Dignity of the human person is not an act of Love and is thus anti Christ.
Referring to oneself or someone else according to sexual inclination sexually objectifies the human person and is thus a violation of Christ’s Commandment regarding lust and the sin of adultery. We are not heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual…, we are husbands and wives, fathers and mothers, sons and daughters, brothers and sisters…, called to live our lives in a communion of Love, while orienting ourselves to The Perfect Communion of Love, The Blessed Trinity. All persons have the inherent Right to come to know The True God and learn to develop healthy and Holy relationships that are grounded in authentic Love.
May 13th, 2012 at 11:40 am
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense — Michael Horton’s explanation for why gay marriage seems so sensible to much of society is a good addition to the roundup of articles I posted the other day. [...]
May 13th, 2012 at 2:54 pm
God said “be fruitful and multply” – same-sex partners can’t do that. In my opinion, ’nuff said.
May 13th, 2012 at 5:00 pm
“Everything we do is not done as Christians, and I think that is particularly the case with voting.”
If this be the case, and I agree with you, then as Christians we have a responsibility to refrain from voting. If we cannot vote and do it as Christians, we have no business doing it.
May 13th, 2012 at 5:42 pm
I love reaching your closing line:
“How would someone who believes that sin is unhappiness and salvation is having “your best life now” make a good argument against same-sex marriage?”
Most people’s personal mission statement on life are like an unmoored boat floating out of the harbour.
Barack Obama might have missed more than a few a bible study groups over the past few years or he’s no more getting the quality teaching a place like my humble neighbourhood church provides. And that just one of the problems of being in power.
Christian fellowship, preaching, holiness, scriptural study and the ongoing pursuit of perfection, it’s hard to make time but not impossible. Start with prayer…
May 13th, 2012 at 11:09 pm
stability and understanding found in same-sex marriages does not make it biblical. On the other hand, faithfulness and understanding isfound ineven in other relationships like friedship. “What does the Bible say” must be the question asked upon every single issue/crises that we would come across in our day-to-day lives. There may be paradigmn shift in the culture, tradition and customs that we are in. But teh Word of God remains the same at all ages. For our God is unchanging God.
May 14th, 2012 at 12:55 am
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense: Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God—if he exists—is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. To the extent that this sort of “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” prevails in our churches, can we expect the world to think any differently? /* Categories: Worth a Look [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 3:11 am
The universe may not be about me but YOUR universe is to be about God AND about your neighbor (Jesus’ #1 and #2 commands). The well being of others (including the those in the LGBT community) IS something that should greatly concern you.
May 14th, 2012 at 5:09 am
[...] Horton, http://www.whitehorseinn.org/blog/2012/05/11/same-sex-marriage-makes-a-lot-of-sense/ Like this:LikeBe the first to like this [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 5:40 am
The question ultimately needs to come down to the eternal, invisible kingdom of God rather than what happens here on earth. Do Christians hinder or help the kingdom of God by being so vehemently against same-sex marriage in the public forum? There is room to disagree here, but I personally believe we could do more to reach out to those trapped in homosexuality, and help them escape, if we did not campaign against such marriages. I’m not saying to vote FOR it, but just to not be so active in the politics which could be hurting our witness and distracting from our main mission.
I wish I saw more about what the church should do about it, especially in places where it is already legal. I think pastors should refuse to officiate such marriages and it should be a disqualification for church membership to be in such a relationship. But why are trying to force the State to do what we should be doing in the church? Where is church discipline?
I want Christians to build bridges to sinners, not to condone their sin and affirm their lifestyle, but to reach them for Christ. We all to often resemble the crowd of pharisees looking to stone the women who is a sexual sinner, instead of Christ saying “Neither do I condemn you, go [i]and sin no more.[/i]
We definitely should never lose sight of the end of that phrase, “go and sin no more.” Many of us in the “post-culture war” generation still understand this. I do not condone sin, I do not elevate the self over Christ or the scripture. But too often I see the Church as known for their condemnation, and not their love. Let’s aim for balance between forgiveness and grace and an abhorrence of sin.
To sum up: I do not actively oppose same-sex marriage not because I do not think it’s a sin, or because I think churches/pastors should accept such marriages, but because I want to build bridges to sinners for the Gospel.
May 14th, 2012 at 7:38 am
A great article! I think it may be one of the best explanations I’ve heard explaining why many Christians have felt enabled to move beyond the traditions of their faith communities and take what many may assume to be a more radical, liberal, leftist, loving, freeing, (insert favorite adjective here) position on the subject. From a sociological lens, I think the author hit a slam dunk. I agree that a follow up on the theology would be interesting.
But isn’t this debate, once again, about what to do with the Bible? As an example, Christians hold dear to our trinitarian dogma despite the Bible’s insistence that “God is one”. Now I understand well the complexities of a triune God and indeed affirm it myself; however it could be argued that the Bible affirms a poly-theistic understanding of Christianity rather than a trinitarian understanding. The Truth of God’s very nature does not have a strictly biblical framework yet holds a strictly biblical foundation. We more or less seem to have settled on a triune god as being true. Isn’t that a greater risk than letting two dudes get married? But this is not a debate about risk. At least, not for most people. TRUTH sits on the edge of a precipice for most Christians in this issue. So my question then is this: if Truth can reveal to us the very nature of God, can Truth create space, safety, and blessing for the LGBT community in our midst? Or perhaps the better question: Would we allow it to?
May 14th, 2012 at 9:01 am
“Christians hold dear to our trinitarian dogma, despite the Bible’s insistence that God is One.”
God Is Love.
Love exists in relationship.
The Blessed Trinity is The Perfect Communion of Love. There is only ONE Perfect Communion of Love.
We have been created in The Image of God, equal in Dignity, while being complementary as male and female.
At the end of The Day, it is still a Great Mystery,
May 14th, 2012 at 11:08 am
[...] Michael Horton -22.558597 17.060995 Share this:TwitterFacebookEmailPrintLike this:LikeBe the first to like this [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 11:43 am
Kyle Jones wrote: “I do not actively oppose same-sex marriage not because I do not think it’s a sin, or because I think churches/pastors should accept such marriages, but because I want to build bridges to sinners for the Gospel.”
Well, that sounds very nice, but there are two obvious questions. First, how in the world does being against same-sex marriage on Biblical grounds reduce the power of your gospel message? If you think about it, this kind of “gospel” message is exactly the thing Dr. Horton is talking about. Any “gospel” message that involves not facing up to the reality of EVERYTHING the Bible presents as sin is not a true gospel message. I really don’t want to be disrespectful, but I would suggest that Christians with your theology are exactly whom Dr. Horton is addressing with his blog posting.
Second, where does one stop with such arguments? Should we not be in favor of putting people in jail for murder or rape because we want to “build bridges” to murderers and rapists? The two have absolutely nothing to do with each other, again, at least not if you are trying to be faithful to how the apostles preached the gospel. Once again, Horton is spot-on in recognizing that “you can’t legislate morality” is a complete shibboleth.
May 14th, 2012 at 11:50 am
From what can be understood, the material Michael Horton provides nails it with the view that we as people cannot defend same-sex marriage within our society because the working theology of Americans by and large, is moralistic-therapeutic-deism. In short, it is all about us (me) within America.
The Christ Presbyterian Church correctly asserts the same-sex marriage debate will be lost on religious grounds before it is lost on political grounds.
As to whether or not homosexuality is abhorrent to God, I can only state that you read your Bible. Not pieces of the Bible, but entire books within the Bible to gain context of what is written. If you have not done this much then seriously question yourself what is your information based upon?
Do not make the mistake of taking OT laws and trying to apply them verbatim within the American venue. Different contexts must be recognized (American pluralist society as opposed to the Israel OT society with their ceremonial, civil, and Moral laws were in effect). We (as Americans) do not stone people for various offenses defined in the OT as those fall under Israel’s OT civil laws because the people lived under a system of government known as s theocracy. To see real-world examples of this look to various countries in the Middle East. The consumption of pork fell under ceremonial laws and was removed within the NT. That leaves the moral laws, which were not removed.
Here is a new thought to dwell upon. If-When same-sex marriage becomes legal within the US at the federal level (and Congress dismantles the Defense of Marriage Act) and forces States to accept it, persecution of a different sort will start appearing across the US unless federal legislation blocks it. Right now in States where same-sex marriages are legal and Church pastors are refusing to perform same-sex marriages. The results are predictable enough, cries of discrimination, lawsuits, and leading to possible prosecution.
In addressing the question as to why same-sex marriage or homosexual relations are hot-topic issues think on this. Which activity is defines the person in question and places that identity on their shoulder in other peoples’ faces? Does a person involved in adultery say they are an adulterer and announce it from the roof-tops (so to speak)? Does a person who commits thievery identify themselves as a thief and announce it for all to hear? Gluttony and drunkenness are forms of idolatry. When it sinful issue becomes an identity issue then we usually find its issue definition changed to a character issue.
May 14th, 2012 at 12:04 pm
[...] To read on, click here: [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 1:12 pm
I don’t like to post comments in these threads, because I think they contribute to what Paul was talking about in 2 Timothy 2:23
“Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels.”
I think many times as Christian’s we try to reconcile the Scripture with the culture, but the Bible is so counter-cultural that this is impossible to do. As Christians we must look at everything through a biblical world view. 2 Peter 1:3 says that “His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and Godliness.” I think there are 2 main questions in this article and in this discussion as a whole that we as Christians must answer.
1. Is homosexuality sin?
You don’t have to look far in the scripture to answer this question, and the answer is yes. Romans 1:18-32 gives a very clear picture of this. And this is more than just a condemnation of Homosexuality in the church, v.18 says that “the wrath of God is revealed from Heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men.” God’s wrath is revealed against sin (all sin, not just homosexuality), and the only way to avoid this wrath is truly submitting to Jesus Christ as Lord of your life. We all are in need of a Savior, not just the Homosexual. I think it’s important to recognize that.
2. Should Christians apply a Biblical view in the Political realm.
Yes. Romans 1:32 “Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them, but give approval to those who practice them.” As Christians when we are given an opportunity to oppose or to vote in favor of legislation that legitimizes sin, we must take the Biblical stance and not “give approval” to sin.
I have seen many people accuse this position of being judgemental or unloving. But if Paul under the inspiration of the spirit actually meant that “God’s wrath is revealed from heaven” against sin, then it would be unloving to not point people towards repentance and a reconciled relationship with their Creator. There is great freedom in submitting to the scripture in these discussions because I am freed from having to take the stance of “Judge.” The scripture gives righteous judgements, so I don’t have to. Romans 2 warns against man taking the stance of “judge,” but we must know that “the judgement of God rightly falls on those who practice” sin.
I greatly appreciate the thoughtfullness of this article. It gets to the root issue here, that Christianity has moved away from it’s God-centeredness and has transformed into a me centered moralistic therapudic deism. I pray that nothing that I’ve written will be taken as pridefull or judgemental, but instead that in love and humility the word of God would be rightly proclaimed.
May 14th, 2012 at 1:25 pm
[...] conservative Reformed persons Michael Horton and Kevin De [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 1:37 pm
Shawn: “I think that some of those who commented are misreading this article. I believe the author, like me, is not for gay marriage. Am I wrong?”
I don’t know.
May 14th, 2012 at 3:50 pm
For those wondering about the Biblical view of homosexuality, please read Romans 1. It is CLEARLY ststed….
May 14th, 2012 at 4:38 pm
Just don’t call it marriage. Don’t take away from this sacred covenant between a man and a woman. Call it whatever else you desire as a “new name” because it is a newer and different union. There…call it a “union” or whatever…get creative and be original! It is different so give it a different name. Is that so difficult?!
May 14th, 2012 at 4:44 pm
[...] Same Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense [...]
May 14th, 2012 at 4:50 pm
@ Truth Unites… and Divides, @ Shawn, yes, the author is not for Same Sex Marriage.
In a nutshell Michael Horton’s saying that wishy-washy christians, wanting to “relate” to society in meaningful ways (society’s definition of meaningful) packing some heavy-laden gospel under their arms are shooting themselves in the foot. Misteaching, mishearing, misinterpreting, egotism, these are activities all bordering on a cloudy heresy but heresy nonetheless. It might be a wonderful, marvelous gospel to some but it’s not THE gospel.
This seemingly insurmountable baggage society is putting on christians for taking a stance on SSM is all the more reason to simply proclaim the gospel.
God is not against any group, forgiveness is for all. “Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?” Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.” Matt 18 21-22. Read it all in context, it’s not that simple, it will offend you.
Where does that leave homosexualists? God forgives sinners and expects repentance of their sin. He expects all sinners to sin no more. Under the topic heading of sin is one word: “sin”.
There are so many laws in our society that protect sinners and allow them to continue in their sin. Corporate laws come to mind and the lawyers who manipulate the justice system as two oversimplified, archetypical, international examples.
So what is wrong with Same Sex Marriage under this kind of society?
Nothing much as far as our host society is concerned. What christians are concerned about is that homosexualists will be given a veil of holiness through the established gift of marriage from God, as if the church condones it. Like the local corrupt businessmen who pay for the church building for the approval of other men, not to get on his knees before God and thank Him for forgiveness, no, that’s not what’s what he wants. He’s getting what he wants now. Like the SSM, it’s all about the “now”.
What offends people is that they can’t accept that the body or church of believers and followers in Jesus really does not condone SSM but not because of the reasons shouted by opponents. It’s about as relevant as gays who dress up as nuns and priests at Sydney’s annual Gay Mardi Gras. It looks pathetic, sad, a sham and a real cry for help. So they shop for one that does accept SSM and they’re handed a gospel that sounds wonderful but isn’t THE gospel, and they enter a marriage which isn’t blessed by God even though so many people approve of it. And they don’t repent because they’re not letting the gospel through, or worse, they’re not getting the gospel. They’ll die unforgiven in their sin and that hurts the heart of the christian and grieves the Holy Spirit.
The next questions are, if one or both members of a SSM become christian and seeks divorce, will the church approve? (The legal system doesn’t care.) What if the non-convert in the broken relationship seeks counselling from the church over the trauma of separation, the news of which forces innocent members of the church to take sides? What if two married gays attend your church for over a year and claim membership of the body even though they are married to continue in acts of homosexualism and the body doesn’t approve and asks them to refrain? Will they have a right to sue the church claiming discrimination and a clandestine bigotry was warred against them? What if a christian photographer or wedding musician refuse to take a booking for a SSM ceremony? Will they be taken to court for discrimination and violation of human rights?
I muffle my screams.
May 14th, 2012 at 5:23 pm
Christopher: “@ Truth Unites… and Divides, @ Shawn, yes, the author [Professor Michael Horton] is not for Same Sex Marriage.”
If so, glad to hear it. It would be edifying to the Body of Christ if Professor Horton would write a post or article on why he is NOT for Same Sex Marriage, and expositing the reasons supporting his decision for why he is NOT for Same Sex Marriage.
May 14th, 2012 at 5:43 pm
@Truth Unites… and Divides, I kind of know what you mean, however, I got the meat of his blog essay loud and clear.
Maybe you’re saying he should make it easier to read because some people may not get it?
But you already know how people read and hear what they want to.
For example (and not to raise Michael’s article to any lofty heights than the level of a common but well written blog) the gospel isn’t palatable no matter how easy it is to read.
Prof Horton’s remarks are not in defence of SSM, they’re in criticism of a weak gospel (or fake gospel = non gospel) being the one golden platform rung at the top of the scaffold of defence of SSM while some christians are blissfully unaware that the absence of the true gospel of Jesus is represented by the missing rung right down the bottom.
I hope you get what I mean. Cheers
May 14th, 2012 at 6:14 pm
I look at this article and agree with much of it. I, however, see it a little more simply. The Bible teaches me that God is the creator of the family unit. He set the rules for us, and allows us the choice to follow or not. Those who choose same-sex marriage, which I believe is an oxymoron, are using their God given right to freewill. I believe he created it, and he it is a simple matter of faith. It is not for us to theologically debate our point of view with anyone who does not share our faith. It is a short path to a long, and unproductive conversation. I believe we are called to love people where they are. I believe we are called to show people unconditional love so that they ask us why we love as we do. I also believe we allow God to do the convincing and changing as we are his hands and feet in a world that is very dark with misdirection and illusion. Allowing God to change the world and others individually is the highest calling of a Christ follower.
May 14th, 2012 at 6:38 pm
“Prof Horton’s remarks are not in defence of SSM, they’re in criticism of a weak gospel (or fake gospel = non gospel)”
That’s fine. If Professor Horton wants to criticize a weak or fake gospel, then by all means, do so,
However, the Body of Christ would be greatly edified and strengthened by him expositing how a “strong” Gospel proclamation is congruent with manifesting a faithful Christian’s opposition and a faithful Church’s opposition to Same Sex Marriage.
May 14th, 2012 at 6:49 pm
I think Prof Horton stayed on track with his provocative topic heading.
78 comments and counting…
May 14th, 2012 at 8:23 pm
@ Truth Unites… and Divides
…and the gospel is not hanging on Prof Horton’s writing to go ahead and be the gospel for unbelievers today.
He knows the same gospel as you.
The gospel of Jesus Christ, power of the Holy Spirit and the various gifts of spiritual discernment should be all you need. You don’t need Horton to edify you…
Australia has the same problems as the Americas, Africa and Asia, ie, sin. And guess what? Not every sinner is preoccupied with the sexual politics debate. But they all need the gospel, and they don’t need Horton’s edifying words for today, to plant a church.
Cheers
May 14th, 2012 at 11:21 pm
Legal marriage is a status conferred exclusively by the state — it has nothing to do with religion which is why the opinions of holybooks are irrelevant. The guiding legal document for America is the Constitution. Churches, synagogues, mosques, voodoo huts — they are all free to conduct their own rituals and sacraments which are meaningless in the eyes of the law.
May 15th, 2012 at 1:30 am
Hi everyone,
I usually don’t follow this site. I know about Dr. Horton. Hear about some of his books. I am not a Calvinist in any of the five points…
Anyways, I read some of the comments, and wanted to recommend two very important books on the subject that will help you (a) see the agenda more clearer, and (b) home some solid arguments to refute pro-homosexual rhetoric:
(a) http://www.amazon.com/Correct-Politically-Same-Sex-Marriage-Everyone/dp/1607081628
(b) http://www.amazon.com/Queer-Thing-Happened-America-Strange/dp/0615406092
the author of the second book above also have DVDs for sale, which are pretty good (and socking) on http://askdrbrown.org/resources/store?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage_new.tpl&product_id=21&category_id=8
I hope Church can make a difference when it comes to this subject, because secular folks already ‘flushed their heads’. It is actually amazes me how nowadays being pro-homoseuxality is almost always proportionate to being secular. very strange, but if you read “queer thing happened” it will at least shed some light on why this is the case.
Best wishes, and God bless all!
May 15th, 2012 at 1:48 am
btw, I also live in Escondido.
May 15th, 2012 at 4:29 am
[...] marriage” soon, but I thought I’d pass along a few stories. First is from the White Horse Inn blog, and takes a theological bent. The main thrust is that folks on both sides of the argument tend to [...]
May 15th, 2012 at 5:10 am
oh for wisdom and love. I don`t have the human answers, but will point out this. What do you think public schools will be teaching all children if same-sex marriage is legalised and condoned by the government ??? What will happen to the exemptions in the anti-discrimination act ??? What will be the repocussions if my 9 year old son refuses a sleep over at his friends house of which has a couple of homosexual men overseeing the evening because he is uncomfortable with the set-up there ??? Think of the children if you don`t have the discernment to use scripture and God`s wisdom here.
May 15th, 2012 at 5:33 am
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Makes a Lot of Sense [...]
May 15th, 2012 at 5:57 am
Wow, I’m really surprised at the comments. Some folks don’t seem to get the point of the article, and among those that do, there are some fairly troubling logical issues with some of the reasoning. To me, this boils down to two questions as Daniel said above. Although I’m less comfortable with his answers, I do agree the questions are the right direction.
1. What does scripture say about homosexuality? I’ve seen compelling arguments both for and against. It doesn’t take much research to find arguments on both sides from the scriptures. (To their own disservice, both sides also fall into the trap of the MTD religion to which the article refers.) And while I am not a Greek scholar, I do feel that I understand enough to at least comprehend the response from both sides of the discussion. So, which is right? How do we handle these matters where two groups differ in their interpretation of a passage? It is surely not a gospel issue, so is it then treated as a Romans 14 issue? In which case, those with the stricter stand should not judge those with freedom. I’m not certain that applies, but I am curious because of the fact that there are seemingly valid scriptural responses on both sides of the issue.
2. Even if you believe it to be a sin, what is the scriptural response of a Christian when it comes to imposing moral (Biblical?) regulations in a civil setting? Many would say we draw the line with the Bible, and I would agree. But how does that apply with issues where differing opinions and interpretations are present? I came from a brand of Fundamentalism that would call it sinful for women to wear pants, people to use versions other than KJV, and listening to any modern music at all. And for each of these, they have Bible verses to back them up. While I disagree strongly with their interpretations of these verses, I recognize the problems within their own conscience they would have in participating in these “sins”. So while I don’t want to force them do participate, I neither want their interpretation enshrined into law. As absurd as it may sound to have a law preventing the use of any version of the Bible besides KJV, the parallels are there. So, when we have an issue where we believe sin is involved, what is the proper (Biblicaly based) civil response? Should we work for laws making any and all activities we consider sinful to be illegal?
These are the real questions that I would love to see answered. I think the right direction is scriptural answers, and when we get beyond the “me” of the situation, beyond what makes the “individual” happy and really examine scripture, how do we answer these questions.
2.
May 15th, 2012 at 2:28 pm
To Nietzsche’s credit, rather than view the Death of God as “party time,” he fully recognized its tragic implications:
“The madman jumped into their midst and pierced them with his eyes. “Whither is God?” he cried; “I will tell you. We have killed him—you and I… But how did we do this? How could we drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What were we doing when we unchained the earth from the sun? Whither are we moving?… Are we not straying through an infinite nothing? Do you not feel the breath of empty space? Do we hear nothing as yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we smell nothing as yet of the divine decomposition? Gods, too, decompose. God is dead… And we have killed him.
How shall we comfort ourselves…? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of the deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?” (From: The Gay Science, #125)
May 15th, 2012 at 6:07 pm
Good article and i think he is right.
once again highlighting the failure of Christians of all types to recognize just how radically faith is really suppose to alter us….and that the commandment against taking (using) the Lord Name in vain (for our purposes in contradistinction to His will for us personally or mankind collectively) is the heart of the matter that undermines our ability to make an argument on the secular level.
Since Christians have compromised or outright rejected the sacramental nature of covenant relationship of marriage and reduced it to a contractual arrangement, the graces provided by God in the union are compromised (not completely) so we are less able to receive the help that the Holy Spirit would pour out in our relationship. This union, christian in name only, fails to demonstrate the contrast between the blessing of Holy Matrimony, the sacrament and the ill of the counterfeit secular version. Therefore christian marriages look too often no different then those of non-Christians.
At the heart of the rejection of same sex marriage in Christianity is rooted in the reality that earthly marriage between the spouses was and always will be designed by God to be an earthly sign of the heavenly relationship within the Godhead – that is the Trinity. The relationship within the Godhead is one of life giving love that is so completely self donating that it produces the fruit of another person. So the love of the Father for the Son and the Son for the Father is so profoundly powerful that it produces the Holy Spirit who “proceeds” from the Father and the Son. Earthly marriage is designed to be a sign of the Trinity. Two loving spouses giving themselves fully to one another such that their love is manifest 9 mos later so powerfully you have to give it a name. Divorce destroys the earthly sign by dissolving the indivisible. Contraception destroys the fruitfulness of the union thus compromising the sign of the Trinitarian life-giving fruitful love. Gay unions cannot accomplish the sign…and therefore are rejected as acceptable within true Christianity. As Christianity has systematically compromised its duty to preserve the sign of the Trinity thru convenental marriage, it has shut itself out of the moral argument concerning gay marriage. It has already rejected its duty as a sign of the fruitful love of the Trinitarian relationship in the Godhead. That is the only real argument in morality it had to put forth. Since all Christians institutions have either compromised on divorce and contraception or in the case of Catholicism maintained the doctrine but failed to instruct its followers on the truth of the still held doctrine such that most Catholics dissent with the church’s teachings in these areas, we are poorly equipped to fight the moral battle on this social issue.
Yet the Truth being true usually means there will be found factual evidence that those things that reject Gods perfect plan for mankind will have social, economic, or health related negatives that can be used to demonstrate the perversion they truly are. That is the place to study and argue. Unless, the church restores itself as salt and light, the world will slowly seek to counterfeit every sacramental aspect of the faith, because Satan doesn’t create de novo evil to counter God’s good; he simply makes a counterfeit version of good to offer mankind in its place.
May 15th, 2012 at 6:59 pm
Thanks for the article Mike. A lot of material to think through. However, I feel what is missing from the debate is a robust defense of heterosexuality from the perspective of the Noahic covenant.
Surely the created order, which was given to the kingdom of this world for all time, can be found there. If this is true, then to endorse homosexual marriage would be seen as rebellion against the covenant. Non-Christians would not care less of course, but the Church is falling all around us here!
All I hear from conservatives is a reference to the Mosaic covenant. Sure, that tells us how God feels about homosexuality for Israel at that time, but to connect the dots, the Church needs to go back to Noah and then, I would say, to creation.
Has someone produced such a work?
May 15th, 2012 at 8:21 pm
[...] http://www.whitehorseinn.org/blog/2012/05/11/same-sex-marriage-makes-a-lot-of-sense/ Share this:TwitterFacebookLike this:LikeBe the first to like this post. This entry was posted in KFD. Bookmark the permalink. ← Jesus on the Age of the Earth Seven Key Ideas from C. S. Lewis → [...]
May 15th, 2012 at 9:23 pm
This article exudes the Kantian core of reformed thought. Moral-therapeutic-deism is a red herring. Morality to reformed thinkers has to be antithetical to happiness because if it were about “social, psychological, and health benefits,” then it wouldn’t be “objective.” “God-centered-ness” is just another word for the same subject-less vantage point that modernity seeks in science. God’s reasoning has to be wholly other and completely inexplicable; otherwise He’s an anthropocentric genie out of the bottle. The result of this anti-anthropological thrust is a comfortable nihilism that explains why reformed theology is such a hit with the American middle class who want to receive divine sanction for their Protestant work ethic.
May 16th, 2012 at 3:04 am
Horton has written an insightful article that sounds an alarm for the body of Christ. The comments that follow affirm his observations. Our society seems to have abandoned the teaching of basic logic and rhetortic. Out of an educational system that focuses on technical skills and specific profficiencies comes a nation of self centered, self authorizing, non critical thinkers.
May God have mercy as He faithfully keeps His promises.
May 16th, 2012 at 6:21 am
[...] was reading an article the other day entitled, “Same-sex marriage makes a lot of sense.” The author is a Christian minister who decidedly believes that same-sex marriage is not [...]
May 16th, 2012 at 7:58 am
There is an irony here, actually it is not irony for Mr Horton’s position, and for him, his position is doxology itself. Unless I’m mistaken, Mr Horton believes that the sovereignty of God requires Him to control everything, e.g. each person’s final destiny has been predetermined to either be redeemed or reprobate. His position may include the argument that Whether or not homosexuality is genetically determined, it is Sovereign God determined. So one could argue logically that to oppose homosexuality would be to oppose God. Ironically the person opposing homosexuality would also be predetermined in his stance. Even the most radical, most embarrassing opponent of homosexuality would be pre-scripted by God to be an embarrassment to the Church and to Mr. Horton. And, of course Mr. Horton’s own position and behavior was pre-set in eternity by the Sovereign God. So, is this discussion merely academic?
May 16th, 2012 at 2:32 pm
[...] Michael Horton: If God exists for our happiness and self-fulfillment, validating our sovereign right to choose our identity, then opposition to same-sex marriage (or abortion) is just irrational prejudice. [...]
May 16th, 2012 at 5:28 pm
@Duane,
Free will? Predestination?
One either chooses God or you rejects Him. You determine that. You’re accountable to yourself and God for that decision.
Jesus died for everyone’s sins, that’s why His death was so tragic.
He rose again to demonstrate He was God incarnate because He had overcome the price of sin, ie, death.
Satan never saw that sting in the tail coming and he knows the scriptures much better than most of us.
But you’ve heard all that before.
Playing the predestination only card will twist you into a knot.
Take everything about God’s knowledge of the future, predestination and our free will in biblical context. That’s the balancing act.
Just analysing man’s actions only through predestination presents a circular argument of little benefit to the biblical scholar in us all as you’ve proven.
You’ve correctly equated a predetermined life all a man to be no better than that of the decision making robot.
You could also say God created everything and is in need of nothing.
Well, He did create all but there is one thing He doesn’t have and that’s your love.
So He stepped out first and sent His only Son that whoever believes Him should not perish but have eternal life.
He didn’t send His Son to condemn the world but to save the world.
Our world was already condemned before Jesus arrived.
Our free will got the world in the mess it is today.
God never denies the full gift of your free will. That’s yours. He never constrains it, never limits it, never oppresses it.
And like any good father, He gives warnings. The rest is still up to us.
You know deep in your heart you’re not a decision making robot.
God didn’t create robots.
You’re not an actor reading out your part for God’s entertainment.
God would never commit you to such a cosmically humiliating and transcendently meaningless existence.
Same Sex Marriage is not the issue. Sure, it’s a political, economic, social, legal football that has religious undertones.
Some might say it’s a revolution. And like all revolutions, it trots out it’s own propaganda seeking to find an enemy to claim freedom from.
But freedom from what exactly?
You aren’t gonna make the church an enemy. A good christian church will love you despite your sin.
But the church doesn’t condone sin because God doesn’t.
And the church is full of sinners forgiven by God through Christ being made more like Jesus through the actions of the Holy Spirit in their lives.
Ain’t nothing new there. Yep, people no better than you, dead to their own sin whatever it is, saved through faith in Jesus’ resurrection.
Basic but big stuff.
Sin is a big topic. To the bible and christians, it’s not all about The Gays believe it or not…
Therefore SSM wanting to hide behind the veil of approval by God is a slap in the face to any deep understanding of the bible.
No one can deny that, because every sin of every man is a slap in the face of God, so what’s new?
So, who do gay couples need to be approved by for their decision?
Well, not the mainstream church, you know it ain’t gonna say yes. Be patient, there’s more.
SSM get’s its approval by man, not by God. True that!
Using the bible as a punching bag and christians as burning efigies against tolerance is a double standard only serving a political purpose.
SSM is looking for an enemy so it creates an opponent of the only group of people that loves them unconditionally.
SSM wants a revolution and needs to prove itself worthy by publicly defeating an opponent.
And we forgive those in the SSM movement as we forgive all who sin. Don’t expect us to not shout out warnings, that’s what people who love do. That’s what friends are for.
Because what SSM is doing is no different to what the society from which SSM seeks approval does daily under the guise of consumerism and materialism.
It’s all about the feel-good NOW.
It’s just that SSM is publicly face-slapping christians to get noticed, like the neo-atheists and the modernists and whatever other ism that proclaims freedom of thought belongs to them only.
And in all this people forget that all we are already condemned by sin and need Jesus’ saving grace.
The SSM issue is a giant diversionary smoke screen.
And presenting somewhat lightly prepared arguments parading as intellectual mindgames like predestination into the ring only weaken your argument IMO.
I see many people saying they value free will and hope it is real.
At the same time they seem regard predestination as some sort of transcendent bounding up of fee will and conscious decision making so we’re nothing more than a response waiting for a stimulus. That’s not healthy.
To me that reads like a massive moral excuse based loosely on a tiny slice of scriptural knowledge. A lot pf people do that daily and most of their lives.
Well, biblically, free will is completely free of God’s interference.
Without free will one could rightfully conclude that God is somehow to blame for sin.
Many people are in denial and claim irresponsibility for their actions
The bible talks about that all the time.
It’s not all about SSM.
Cheers
May 16th, 2012 at 6:28 pm
Hi Christopher! Thanks for the reply! I found it most uh… agreeable. My friend on facebook is an article re-post animal, so I see a wide range of resources including this one. So earlier, (I think it was before my comment above)on another post of a related topic, I replied thus:
“It also occurs to me that the media is making this only about homosexuality. The church should refuse to be pigeon holed like that. It’s about the idol of sex that Americans use interchangeably with the idol of liberty. Divorce is evil, and pornography is evil, adultery is evil, and premarital sex and even lust are evil. Even our Christian daughters and sons marrying outside of the faith is evil. It all opposes the Kingdom of God. This case differs only in that Christians oppose the further institutionalization of that evil. This point can also be made if someone asks if you oppose homosexuality.” Sound familiar?
I also agree with your assessment of what this is about, and I would take it a step further. The “same sex marriage” issue boils down to this: legitimacy of every life choice except the one blessed by Father Son and Holy Spirit. The “gay lesbian bi-sexual, transexual” community has it all: “legitimate” choices in agreement with the majority of the population, they have the consensus and blessing of the psychological profession, they have above average education opportunities,and the blessing of their educators and they have above average careers and income. The one thing they lack is acceptance of their idols with God. They imagine that gaining legitimacy from God’s church will make them happy. So the goal is stalinization of America on gay lesbian issues. We will agree with the gay agenda, or we will be re-educated until we do. That, brother Christopher is why this is a hot political issue. Before this is over, you will not be allowed to require a pastoral candidate to affirm his belief that marriage between one man and one woman is the only blessed union before God.
If this was truly a dictatorial government, or an oligarchy we may be able to wash our hands of the issue, but since this is constitutionally a “government by the people”, and we are called by our Savior to be salt and light, we are called to at least be informed and at least support those who are vocal in their opposition of the decaying of our society. We are not all called to get personally involved, and we must always act in love for The Lord, for His Church and for the lost, but at the least, we ought to vote for those who will work to preserve the Republic. Peace
May 16th, 2012 at 9:02 pm
[...] I’m back in the swing of writing posts at Wheat & Tares again with my latest: Wickedness Never Was Happiness – Gay Relationships and Mormonism. This post is primarily my reaction to a recent post I read from a non-LDS Christian, entitled “Same-sex marriage makes a lot of sense.” [...]
May 17th, 2012 at 11:21 am
To Connie: Wait for Michael’s follow-up on this. Ultimately our view on this as our worldview generally is to be formed by the Scriptures. Do they have authority on this question or is “Your Best Life Yet” feelings based perspectice. There’s a larger question here, I believe, than just the Bible injunctions against homosexuality and that is there is a prophetic aspect that is sometimes missed, at least I see very little mention of it on the blogs. You may want to check my latest post called “When Sodom Rules the Land” see:http://www.wordsofthislife.ca/2012/05/when-sodom-rules-land.html Politics ultimately will not be the answer because the “moral demograhics” are dramatically shifting.
May 18th, 2012 at 9:41 am
[...] has issued various responses to Obama’s statement, including the insightful post by Michael Horton. But I just want to briefly identify what I consider to be an important methodological distinction [...]
May 19th, 2012 at 2:57 am
Me again,
Did anyone read Brown’s book “A Queer Thing Happened to America: And What a Long, Strange Trip It’s Been ” (http://www.amazon.com/Queer-Thing-Happened-America-Strange/dp/0615406092 ) ???
Just curious.
Let me rephrase my question:
- are you familiar with HRC’s “Corporate Equality Index” ?
- what about “Ze” ? do you know what that is?
- What about homosexualized Bible stories?
I don’t think American Christians can afford not to read it in times like these.
You’ve been predestined to read it, get your copy. There are a lot to learn for average Christian.
May 19th, 2012 at 7:01 am
[...] Same-Sex Marriage Make a Lot of Sense – Michael Horton If God exists for our happiness and self-fulfillment, validating our sovereign right to choose our identity, then opposition to same-sex marriage (or abortion) is just irrational prejudice. [...]
May 19th, 2012 at 6:41 pm
[...] What people like James (of Mormon Midrashim) and David French (who wrote the 2010 post about his change in opinion) and Seth R (who posted said article on his Facebook page and clued me in to it) decry is the shift in marriage to this lateral, lover-and-beloved emphasis on the emotional well-being of adults. Gay marriage cannot help that because gay marriage makes sense primarily because marriage has so shifted predominantly to be an institutio…. [...]
May 20th, 2012 at 8:30 pm
[...] union and are genuinely intrigued by the title of this article as I was, then click here to read [...]
May 21st, 2012 at 10:19 am
Oh my what a great article, I was moved to wonder at first when I say the title, but knowing the work of Bro Horton I knew it was a catch all to make one go furthur in to know the true meaning. Thank God for men like the current REFORMED COMMUNITY, may we share the faith with love, so God can get the glory.
May 21st, 2012 at 7:11 pm
[...] SAME-SEX MARRIAGE MAKES A LOT OF SENSE IF… by Michael Horton Same-sex marriage makes sense if you assume that the individual is the center of the universe, that God — if he exists — is there to make us happy, and that our choices are not grounded in a nature created by God but in arbitrary self-construction. To the extent that this sort of “moralistic-therapeutic-deism” prevails in our churches, can we expect the world to think any differently? If we treat God as a product we sell to consumers for their self-improvement programs and make personal choice the trigger of salvation itself, then it may come as a big surprise (even contradiction) to the world when we tell them that truth (the way things are) trumps feelings and personal choice (what we want to make things to be)…. Read this in full at http://www.whitehorseinn.org/blog/2012/05/11/same-sex-marriage-makes-a-lot-of-sense/ [...]
May 23rd, 2012 at 6:04 am
Many churches have already compromised the scripture by condoneing female elders, abortion and homosexual pastors, what precedents have been set will be humanly impossible to undo. Love the people who oppose you, just don`t engineer scripture so they can be your friends. What will our children say if we compromise the role of parents to be role models, what will they say when we told them we think HIV is less serious than smokers health concequences ??
May 23rd, 2012 at 11:47 am
I am trying to wrestle with this topic from a biblical, ethical perspective. Some of the touch points that arise are… The reason we defend Christian Marriage is that it is the very best and most important expression of who God is, period. In Genesis God said … So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. God is not man or woman, but he is perfect complete union. We cannot affirm gay marriage without doing grave offense to the nature of God. The church has held such a puny view of marriage and its light view of divorce, that we have no one to blame but ourselves when we lack the moral authority to stand against the onslaught of this foundational principle. In gospel terms, another sticking point that I see is the permanent nature of marriage. Homosexuality is no greater a sin than any of the others that Paul list in the works of the flesh, but, with reprobate heterosexuals, if there is repentance, the instruction is to remain in the marriage as long as the unbeliever is willing (no sin, but actually sanctification of relationship). If a homosexual person is married to their lover and later finds repentance, how can he or she remain for any extended period of time and still consider themselves to be repentant. The cloak of virtue that is afforded by the institution of marriage may be trapping numbers of homosexual individuals in the dilution that are not choosing open rebellion against God.
Given where we are and where we are going in the church and as a culture, I grieve to think where we will be in a generation. We will lack the discernment and biblical literacy to even frame these kinds of arguments in 10-20 years.
Can I say that I have people in my life for whom I care deeply that are immersed in the gay lifestyle and I sympathize with their desire for legal protection and the companionship that is a God-given void. “Marriage” is not the answer. When this whole issue gets ironed out, the church must revisit our part in creating this mess. We gave the sovereign rights of God and the church over to the secular government. Having confidence in mere human bodies to steward this institution has left it vulnerable to misuse.
Thanks for the opportunity to pose concerns among thoughtful individuals.
May 24th, 2012 at 9:51 am
[...] a hindrance to the LGBTQ lifestyle as once thought. Again, I will refer to Michael Horton’s article, which indirectly addresses some of the fallacious ways in which Christians tend to argue against [...]
June 4th, 2012 at 9:21 am
I find the crux of the argument to lay in the proposition put before the California court: “The institution of marriage offers social, psychological, and health benefits that are denied to same-sex couples.” I think it is abundantly clear that indeed people in marriages (whether Christian, Jewish, Pandeist, Atheist, gay, straight, interracial, Eskimo, whatever) enjoy better health and longer lives. So to tell a group “you can not marry” is to strip years from them, condemning them to a probability of ill health and earlier deaths.
The problem of asking whether we ought to support or condemn ‘same-sex-marriage’ is the runing together of religious ideals with the practical operation of a government which is not supposed to restrict religion or dictate aspects of the religious life. There is a difference between supposing a ‘marriage’ ought to be recognized and respected by the Church, and by the State.
After all, if the Bible is to be taken at all seriously, then a divorcee is not to marry. Yet few today would give much thought to the idea that the state ought to prohibit such remarriages, even as people divorce whenever they begin to feel unfulfilled and go on to their third and fourth and fifth marriages. That people do this in marriage is far more undermining to the institution than who it is who marries (this is aptly demonstrated by the historical religious condemnation of interracial marriage as a practice which would weaken the institution; interracial marriages are no more volatile than same-race marriage).
But at the end of the day the question really is, how much power are we going to give the State to govern social institutions. Because, if we tell the state “you may prohibit people from marrying based on their respective sex” we are (absurd as it may sound today) openning the door to a future government prohibiting people from marrying those of the opposite sex!! Better to restrict the power of government in the field altogether and simply remove its power to weigh in on the validity of marriage any more than it may do so with the validity of Baptisms and Communions.